From Kat: Harold Lewter is the perfect remedy for a wild first week of 2021. Or, as he would call it, 2020.1: Not a new year, just the next version of 2020. 

I started admiring Harold, a manager and partner at CLA, during my time at HCKR. In every email you could sense his zest for the business, his creativity, his compassion, and a personality that never left you without a smile.

Getting to know Harold better throughout this interview, he’s even more than your industry dreams could hope for. From a rapped introduction, navigating a career he didn’t plan for, and dreaming of what the business could be tomorrow, Harold has us laughing, thinking, and ready to get to work. 

We think it takes a heart of gold to fill out our lengthy questionnaire, but Harold might have one of the best. Enjoy his wisdom, his heart, and his two life mottos that we all should adopt.

Harold! We’re thrilled and honored you’re taking the time to chat with us. We’ll get into the business facts; would you introduce yourself to our readers with some “human facts”?

Absolutely! (Begins to rap) My name is Harold and I’m here to say, “I’m from the Bronx and I’m here to stay! What’s to tell about the Bronx? It’s uptown and to the right!” (hehe) …Let’s see what else, I am the youngest of 5, my interest for musical theatre began at 8 years old, when my older brother took my mom and I to see Starlight Express on Broadway, which coincidentally he would end up booking the 1st National Tour as Electra later that year.

My mom has always had a love for theater, and so we would go see shows all the time. However, I did not fall in love with musical theater until I saw Vanessa Williams in Kiss of the Spider Woman (Kander & Ebb) in 1994 (P.S. She replaced Chita Rivera). There’s this fabulous moment in the show where she comes out in a cage in this Birds of Paradise inspired costume (UGH JUST THE BEST) and she sings “Gimme Love”, during the dance break there is this fantastic Trumpet solo (I played the Trumpet from 2nd grade through High School) …I WAS HOOKED FROM THAT MOMENT ON! Also, not to mention the choreography was just to die for! 

…I could go on, but I don’t think we have time for that (so I will save the rest for my memoir one day). 

You went to Wagner College for Musical Theatre and also went on to study acting at the University of Buffalo. You taught classes and performed in Costa Rica after receiving the Promising Artists of the 21st Century award in 2006. As such an accomplished actor, what made you want to get into the representation side of things? What were the first few steps you took in transitioning to agenting/managing?

Well first let me say this, I had 0 intentions of going into representation, this all happened by happenstance. I had been working off and on throughout college and continued to work as an actor after graduating from college, and then in late Fall of 2009 a good friend of mine Mike Cruz asked me if I would come intern for him at Independent Artists Agency, and I said sure because I didn’t have anything else to do. So, there I went, and as time went on, one thing led to another and another and before I knew it was July of 2010 and I went on vacation and while I was on vacation, I got an e-mail announcing that the agency was going to be closing in a few weeks. No clue of what to do next, I said to Cyd and Mike that whatever happens next, I want to continue to help out. So, there we all went and because Cyd had only sold the roster when she left the business in 2001 we reopened her management company Cyd LeVin & Associates. 

Now, I should rewind back to the beginning because the thing that really pushed me into representation was the realization that I was getting tired of seeing actors spin their wheels, and not get the feedback they needed to move their careers forward. Being at Independent I realized quickly that as rep you could do that. 

You joined CLA in August 2010 after crossing paths with Cyd LeVin at Independent Artists Agency in late 2009. What has been the most rewarding thing to come from that partnership? 

I have always been a hard worker, but working with Cyd has taught me how to not only work hard, but how to fight for the people you believe in. As for rewarding, there have been so many rewards that have come from this partnership…when I was first starting out, I had all of the passion, but none of the training, so the first reward was training. The second reward (or rewards) was the importance of honesty, integrity and the power of building relationships, for however large this business it, it really is so very small once you really get into it, and you will do business with the same people over and over and over again, so who you are at your core is really important, especially when it comes to your clients and their livelihoods. The third reward is a true mentor who will tell me when I’m wrong and when I’m right, and I feel very fortunate to have someone like that as a friend and a business partner. 

Part of your specialty has included transitioning Broadway actors to TV/Film. Any advice for readers who are theatrical trained and looking to make the switch?

Study, study, study, study!!! It baffles me how many times an actor will walk into the office for a meeting and say, “I want to be on TV, or I want to be a Film star” and which leads me to ask, “ok, so what are you watching? What the last film you saw? Have you watched every single movie on the AFI 100? Have you watched every single Oscar Award winning film?”  and of course, the answer is no, no, no and no. So, how can you want to do something and not have studied it. A doctor doesn’t just wake up one day and say, “I think I will go be a heart surgeon today” no, they study and study and study, and study. As an artist, you should be doing the same. You have to know the craft inside and out. As an actor and even as a rep, I am still a student of the craft. Everyone that knows me, knows that I keep my iPad open while I’m working so that I can watch television or films. 

At the end of the day, it boils down to understanding that when working in TV or Film you as the actor are responsible for telling the truth. On stage you play to the last row, so everything is heightened including your most grounded moments. On Television and on Film it is about real life and living in the truth of the moment. There is no hiding from the camera, and quite frankly why would you want too? It is the vainest medium out there.

It’s no secret that there is a severe underrepresentation of agents and managers of color. What walls need to come down to make a career in representation more accessible?

There are so many walls that need to come down, but the first is you have to go to the HBCU’s and the Colleges & Universities that have a heavy BIPOC enrollment, especially the inner city schools and recruit. Contradictory to that, I have realized that we place so much emphasis on higher education, but we forget that many of the agents and managers we admire did not go to college or for that matter finish High School. Until Talent Representation is taught at the University level, it remains an apprentice trade, which means we shouldn’t be afraid of scouting “talent” early on, no different than construction unions who source talent at the High School level.

What’s the change in our business you hope to see coming out of this time of a racial reckoning and a global pandemic?

Well, I think we are already beginning to see that there is now an expectation for Truth and Transparency in the Entertainment Industry as a whole. What I am hoping is that the playing field begins to level out now, and that it doesn’t feel like a never-ending uphill battle. Truth be told what I want most is for the word “diversity” to stop being such a hot button topic. When Cyd and I re-opened CLA in 2010, it was never about oh we need to get a black actor, a white actor, a Asian actor or LatinX actor, it was just we want talent, the color or race or gender didn’t matter, it still doesn’t matter to us, we want to represent the best (periodt). 

We’ve used the metaphor of a mountain to be analogous to our career accomplishments, dreams, and changes. We feel a lot of our reader’s “climb” is on pause. Has your mountain ever changed? Is it changing now? What’s keeping you moving?

My mountain has changed several times throughout the last 10 years, and I finally feel like I’m on the mountain that I want to be on and most of all I know what my purpose is. I have always had two life mottos, “innovate or die” and “never stop learning, never stop growing” and 2020 has really challenged me to reaffirm my commitment to those mottos and to also challenge and push myself. Pre-Pandemic I was feeling STUCK, in the midst of the pandemic in June I was feeling like the world was passing me by and that I needed to shift my focus and do something else. In July after a client, I had spent so much time developing and putting the building blocks of his career in place dropped me I started to put building blocks in place to build a company that was focused on Diversity and Training for positions outside of the performance realm, because I felt like I didn’t want to be in Talent Representation anymore and also because I felt like I didn’t know who I was without representing this person anymore. Low and behold in August, I took a trip to the beach and it brought me back to the center, my center. I realized I was listening to everyone else’s thoughts and opinions, and worrying about what everyone else was doing, my focus was on the wrong things. Now, I’m solely focused on myself and building CLA Partners into the global powerhouse I believe it can be. Can’t stop won’t stop! 

RAPID FIRE:

Favorite Quaran-TV: The Queen’s Gambit is the best thing I’ve seen all Quarantine. 

Quaran-reads: Currently reading Television Development by Bob Levy

Exercise routine (if you are into that): I was doing so good with taking my lunch time 3mile walk up until September when things started to come back online, and we got busy. I really need to get back to that. 

Favorite food: Obsessed with Greek Yogurt, Honey & All of the berries I can get my hands on!!

You can only choose one, tennis or golf: Tennis

Thing you have missed most since March: Being with people

Quick advice to actors looking for rep: Put yourself out there, don’t wait for permission. Also, DO NOT BE A SUITCASE ACTOR and follow some given list that someone has prescribed for you. If there’s an agency you really want to get a meeting with, be persistent, keep showing them more of your work. I guarantee you someone is always looking at submissions, especially if they’re doing their job right. 

Favorite part of the job: A clients first major booking…nothing better than making that call. 

Religious, Spiritual, or Nah: Definitely spiritual!

Social Media Feelings: Social media and I have a real love hate relationship. 

Advice to your younger self: FOCUS LEWTER!

Social Media Handles: @itsmrlewter (on insta) and @clapartners (on insta)

Anything you’d like to promote?: NOPE…except if you haven’t watched The Queen’s Gambit on Netflix, watch it.

From Kat: Chinyere Anyanwu, who goes by ChiChi, introduced herself to me in the way that I admire the most: She didn’t tell me who she was, she showed me. 

I was, as most of us were, idly searching for ways to fill my time during the beginning months of COVID. ChiChi sent me an email saying she had been laid off from the management office I knew her from, but was starting her own company. Badass, right? Then, she offered to set up a phone call so we could get to know each other. Me. The “me” that’s still an associate getting a meeting with a new business owner. After our lovely conversation, she had sent me another email inviting me to the Broadway Women’s Alliance so I could grow my own network.

From this exchange, and every exchange I’ve had with her since, ChiChi has proven to be generous, creative, ambitious, connecting, prompt, engaging, full of vision, and willing to put in the work to become great. Sounds like the manager we’d all dream of, right? And it’s not just that: It's becoming a manager when the industry has allowed an embarrassing lack of diversity on the side of representation.  It’s her willingness to look beyond who we are on the surface and connect to who we are as humans. It’s the bravery to take the leap of faith and get the L.L.C. We admire her a whole, whole lot and know you will too.

When you’d like to hear more from ChiChi, be sure to check out her interview on Variety's Stagecraft podcast on the Broadway Podcast Network.

ChiChi Anyanwu, Founder and Talent Manager of the recently opened CHI Talent Management, has quickly become one of my favorite people. In watching her open her own Management company and hearing her vision for the future, I can’t imagine a better pacesetter for the person and businessperson we all should be following. ChiChi, we’re so honored to have you on the blog. Before we talk about all your business accomplishments, are there any “human facts” you’d like to introduce to our readers? 

I am the daughter of Nigerian immigrants.  The “CHI” in my name means God in the Nigerian language Igbo, some interpret as the God in you. ChiChi is short for my full name Chinyere which means God’s gift. I tend to go above and beyond in my personal and professional relationships. I like taking care of people. I actively encourage and empower the people around me. All in all, I try to live by name.

You and I, along with so many members of our industry, were laid off as a result of COVID-19. Can you talk us through the brave and badass decision to open your own Management company? What’s the most challenging part of getting a new business off the ground? 

Even after losing my job, many of my clients wanted to continue working with me. Also, my friends and sister, Ngozi, have been telling me for years that I should have my own company.  The fact that so many people believed in me and supported my choice in starting my own company gave me the confidence and strength I needed.  This realization led me to take matters into my own hands and take a leap of faith.  Hence, CHI Talent Management, L.L.C. was born.

The main challenge right now is COVID-19. Since there are new production guidelines in television and film with the limited number of people on set, there is less work for my actor clients.  Casting directors are very selective about who they bring into auditions now as well.  For my clients that are more developmental, it may be harder to get them auditions now in TV and film. 

Also, with Broadway being shut down and no date set yet for reopening, most of the clients on my roster are unemployed.  I’m hoping that the industry will bounce back, and that my artists will be working again consistently.

You began your career in casting.  What are the elements of being a manager that made this side a better fit? How does your start in casting aid your work as a manager?

As a casting intern and assistant, I remember always enjoying talking with agents and their assistants over the phone.  I admired how agents pushed and advocated for their clients as well.    Although I was fond of casting, I realized my true calling was developing and nurturing acting talent.  I feel like my experience in casting gave me a better understanding and appreciation for what casting directors do.  I’m aware that roles don’t always go to the best actor, however I still encourage my clients to always present their strongest audition so that casting will recognize their talent and keep them in mind for future projects.

We listened to your amazing interview with Broadway Podcast Network. One section we loved, among many, is you telling your clients to ‘not lead with your race’. Can you talk to our readers, who are mostly actors, how you submit on breakdowns when race is mentioned? Do you have advice for an actor who feels pigeon-holed based on their name or the way they look?  

Do not limit yourself by only submitting for roles that are specific to your race.  Free your mind and look into roles that you connect with on a basic human level.  If you feel like you can play the role and do it justice, go for it.

It's no secret that there is a severe underrepresentation of BIPOC agents, managers, and casting directors. What’s your biggest dream for a more conscious industry moving forward? 

I am hoping the term “BIPOC” is no longer a thing and that there are more job opportunities for diverse representation.  Its no longer acceptable for me to be on a panel or workshop with other reps and casting directors and be the only person of color in the room.   We have to do better as an industry and actively hire people that reflect the melting pot of America.

We’ve used the metaphor of a mountain to be analogous to our career accomplishments, dreams, and changes. We feel a lot of our reader’s “climb” is on pause. Has your mountain ever changed? Is it changing now? What’s keeping you moving?

I feel like I’m always constantly pushing myself to keep going. The COVID pandemic slowed me down a bit, but I’m choosing to be positive, proactive and to not stop moving froward.  My clients keep me motivated and always inspired by their talent and wanting to do right by them. My family and friends are also constantly encouraging me and I want to prove to myself that I can do this on my own.

RAPID FIRE:

Favorite Quaran-TV:  I May Destroy You on HBO

Quaran reads: More Than Enough by Elaine Welteroth 

Exercise routine (if you are into that):  30 second Jumping rope, 30 Jumping jacks, 15 squats, 15 lunges, 30 second high knees & butt kicks, 30 min stationary bike (4-5x a week).

Favorite food: Jollof Rice and beans 

Thing you have missed most since March: LIVE THEATER!

Favorite thing about being a Manager: Calling my clients when they booked a job.

Favorite part of being a producer:  Collaborating with up incoming writers and directors 

Network growing tip: Don’t be afraid to putting yourself out there and make the first move 

Religious, Spiritual, or Nah: Spiritual

One quality you look for in clients:  Strong work ethic

Social Media Handles: Instagram @chitalentmgmt twitter:  @chi_management

Anything you’d like to promote?:  Check out more info about my clients, who are all available for acting work asap, via my website www.chitalentmanagement.com

Photos by: Terria Clay

From Kat: Bernard swooped into our world at a really pivotal time and in a really pivotal way. He gave a master class for Peter’s grad class while he was seeing a client in a show. 6 months later, we ran into him at a showcase while I was doing my first internship. He, remarkably, remembered who Peter was, chatted with us freely, and became a guiding force for both of us as we found our way through the city.

In that paragraph alone, there’s so many reasons why Bernard became #goals. The ability to remember actors after brief interactions. The willingness to be human. The graciousness of his guiding hand. The desire to help. Anytime I’m faced with a career move I either ask Bernard or ask myself, “How would Bernard handle this?”

It’s been a long time coming to feature Bernard, but I’m glad we waited to this point. He has invaluable insight on becoming a manager, owning your own business, navigating the changes our industry needs, and advocating for the people you love working with. His wisdom pours out of this feature when we all might need a pickup: Do the thing you love in the way you love to do it. Do it for the causes or reasons you love to believe in. And, most importantly, do it with the people you love to work with. I’m thankful Bernard stumbled into my life and I’m beyond thankful to share his wisdom with you.

Bernard, you are from Cleveland, OH (In our opinion, our nation’s best city) and attended Ohio State University. Originally, your eyes were set on being a filmmaker. Can you talk us through finding your footing and figuring out what you wanted to focus on in your career? How has your film background aided what you do now?

I always loved films growing up. And I made a few digital films in college. In 2004, I moved to New York to become a filmmaker. While I was trying to figure out how to break into the business, I bumped into a filmmaker I admired (Tom Gilroy) and worked for about 6 months as his unpaid intern. One morning he called me, emailed me and texted me. Which was super unusual for Tom. I called him back and he told me about how his manager lost her assistant and thought I should apply for the job. I had never worked in an office let alone knew what a manager was. But I went because Tom had told his manager that she should meet me. I met her and she stopped the interview about 5 minutes in while I was in the middle of a story. I thought, “Well of course she stopped me. I’m unqualified for this job in every way.” But she said, “I work on instinct and I think you’re the guy. If you say yes, I’ll give you the keys to my office and you start tomorrow.” And I said yes. Because anyone who says something that brave you just jump on board. If I end up quitting the next day, at least it was worth it for the story. I ended up falling in love with management and realizing that I was meant to do that instead of making films. What I loved about being involved with filmmaking was being around actors. And management let me interact with them on a daily basis. I think every rep goes through a process of refining what kind of talent they are attracted to in their first job. And that was so true for me. At that company we repped a lot of great young actors that did really incredible work but hadn’t had that big thing hit yet. And to see so many of them go onto great things makes me really happy for them. That job really instilled in me the importance of trusting your gut in terms of what I thought was good acting. As far as my film background, I really loved reading scripts and imagining actors we were working with in the roles. 

You’ve had a storied career working for other businesses and being out on your own, most recently establishing Forte Artist Management with Aaron J. Sandler in 2019. Did you know you wanted to eventually own your own business? 

Before Forte, I had previously been an owner at two management companies: Intrepid Talent Management (which I co-owned) and Brownstone Entertainment Management (sole owner). Co-owning Forte with Aaron was a natural fit. He had worked under me at Brownstone and we worked beside each other at Sirensong Entertainment (under owner Donna DeStefano). I had met Aaron when he was working at Hartig Hilepo Agency and we became friends. Aaron is a rockstar. Super smart. Really loves being a manager. And we get along well. So creating Forte together was a natural fit. 

What 2 steps did you take in your first year that helped you to success?

Well I think I’ll speak to the 1st year of being a manager at my own company. I think figuring out what you care about is essential. I’ve been doing this long enough to know that many client relationships do not last the long run. Deciding what kind of clients you want to have really helps define the way the industry sees you and how you will see yourself on a day to day basis. Early in my career I would see someone in a show and if I loved their work I’d just go up to them and see if they had a manager and if not, see if they had any interest in meeting. I don’t do that anymore. Instead I do some research. I talk to people I know that have worked with them, maybe a casting director that cast them in something or even a teacher they might have had. To me getting a sense of their personality is important. Talent is everywhere but I’m no longer at a place in my life where I can only approach those who I think are talented. I have a wife and two kids. And I want to maintain a work life balance. For everyone’s sake.

This is obviously such a strange time we are in. On a personal or professional level, what’s been the most challenging part of this pandemic? 

This is such a great question. I think for everyone, feeling useful is necessary to mental health. So the biggest adjustment for me in regards to work is how hard it is to have so little to do. I’ve been touching base with all my clients and making sure they have everything ready for when things to get going again. Whenever that is. 

On a personal level, it’s been hard on my family. My wife’s work actually increased as a result of the pandemic. And with my kids, they both had their schools go to remote learning so I had to really take on the load of homeschooling. 

What do you think has an opportunity to change as a result of this time to reset? 

I think given the current political climate and the rise of the Black Lives Matter movement, I am super excited about what art is generated as a result of the pandemic. 

I think as things ramp up, we will see the rise of self-tape auditions. I love self-tape auditions…I know some actors don’t like them but they are the most efficient way for everyone in the process to see the most people.

We’ve used the metaphor of a mountain to be analogous to our career accomplishments, dreams, and changes. We feel a lot of our reader’s “climb” is on pause. Has your mountain ever changed? Is it changing now? What’s keeping you moving?

I think for me the way I judge success has changed over my career. 

Where I’ve landed is this: I want to work with actors I love advocating for and enjoy working with.  Helping actors achieve success through smart decisions is what matters to me. Everything else is gravy.

RAPID FIRE:

Favorite Broadway show: August: Osage County (saw it 7 times with the original cast…flew to Chicago to see it at Steppenwolf)

Favorite Quarantine snack: Cool Ranch Doritos

TV show you binge: Two shows I would recommend to binge would be Unbelievable and Escape at Dannemora. Those were my favorite two limited series of 2019 and 2018.

Podcasts you love: The Lowe Post, Dunc’d On, How Did This Get Made?, No Dunks, The Rewatchables

Religious, Spiritual, or nah?: I’m Roman Catholic. I struggle with it because of my liberal political beliefs, but that’s where I land. Fun fact: There was a short time my senior year of high school that I considered becoming a priest.

Biggest tip for finding representation?: Unrepped actors should do their research on actors they admire. Someone whose career they can model theirs after. And then see who reps them. I’d start there and see what they discover.

2-5 words that describe what inspires you: An honest acting moment.

Most important quality of a good Manager: Ability to listen. (I also think that this is the most important quality of a good client.)

Favorite part about being a Manager: My clients. I really enjoy working with my clients.

Best part about being from Cleveland?: It’s home. I live in Cold Spring NY and love it but part of me will always feel like Cleveland is home.

Biggest beef with the business: Lack of diversity. Whenever I see a show cast someone who is a good Caucasian actor I always wonder, “Did the team really consider a person of color?” And more often than not the answer is no. I think that fundamentally needs to change. 

Social media handles?: 

Personal IG and Twitter @bernardfbunye 

Professional IG and Twitter @forteartistmgmt

Anything you’d like to promote?: 

My best friend Nick Peterka and I started a podcast called You Gotta Check This Out https://anchor.fm/you-gotta. It’s a project he and I came up with. Each podcast is only about 20 minutes long at the most.

My client Molly Camp created this incredible web series called Make America Bake Again. It’s not available yet but I want everyone to look out for it because it’s exceptionally made. 

Everyone should watch Mindhunter on Netflix. My client Joe Tuttle is on it and just does such a gorgeous job with his character’s arc.

Photos:

1. Bernard Bunye

2. Bernard and family

3. Running the Philly Half Marathon 2018

4. Bernard with clients: Nadia Gan and Molly Camp

5. Bernard with client, Gabby Beans at Anatomy of a Suicide Opening

6. Bernard with client, Marina Shay getting in a pre-show boxing workout in Florida

7. Bernard with his daughter at a CAVS game

From Kat: I met Lori through a mutual friend who said I, quote, ”HAD to meet Lori”. A chips, salsa, and margarita date later and it was confirmed: Lori was someone I loved being around. (Side note: chips, salsa, and margaritas are always a good formula for success.)

During our time together, Lori and I chatted about life, the industry, and her journey of creating her own business. She is someone who is easy to talk to, passionate about her clients, and interested in making real change in the industry. Sounds like the ideal manager, right? She’s someone I’ve loved getting to know and loved getting inspired by. I hope she does the same for you. So I’ll turn it over to my margarita buddy, Lori Kay.

Lori! We are thrilled to have you be apart of our Manager and Agent portion of our blog. Would you briefly introduce yourself to our readers?

I’m thrilled that you asked! My name is Lori Kay, and I’m the founder and principal manager at Prevail Artist Management (celebrating five years this February). I currently serve as New York Director-at-Large for the Talent Managers Association, I’m a producer for The Heller Awards in Los Angeles, and I’m a member of the Television Academy, the Hollywood Radio & Television Society and New York Women in Film & Television. 

You went to Western Illinois University. Can you tell us how you ended up there and how it impacted your career?

I transferred to WIU on full scholarship in August 2009 and graduated as an honors student with my BA in Acting with a minor in Music Business in December 2011. I was originally accepted as a Musical Theatre major, but a knee injury complicated things about a year in, so I switched my emphasis. I had my Associate of Arts in General Studies from College of Southern Nevada prior to that, but didn’t go further with my formal education as quickly as some do because I was busy working (between CSN and WIU I trained primarily with Joseph Bernard, Chris Bearde and The Second City while working full-time as a performer). Western was really great for me because going to school in Macomb forced me to focus on my education and my craft - something I wouldn’t have been able to do if I had stayed in Vegas. 

What led you to becoming a Manager? You were a successful actress prior to this as well! Can you walk us through making that transition? What were the things you did in the first year to help you start out?

I began working as an actress when I was four years old - that’s when I shot my first commercial in California. I was also a strong vocalist, so I worked mostly on stage both through school and professionally, and I was very fortunate that my parents were supportive of me as a performer; they worked in various tech capacities as well, so I was exposed early on to a well-rounded view of the industry. When I wasn’t on stage, I was cutting gels and moving speaker cases and running follow spots for concerts and trade shows and such. As I got into my teens, I also started dabbling in writing and directing. I graduated high school early and at that point was already working professionally, mostly in Vegas - in 2005 I was listed as one of the “Top 10 Best Things in Stage” by the Las Vegas Weekly. Things were going well for me, but shortly after I moved to New York (which was never really my plan, it just sorta happened) I had some things happen in my personal life that affected my perspective of what I wanted to do. It’s hard to explain, but I chose to tap out. I knew I still loved the industry, but I wasn’t in love with a lot of what went along with being a performer anymore. I experimented with working in other fields, and though I excelled I wasn’t as passionate about those paths as I was about entertainment, so I decided I needed to find a different facet that I could apply my skill set to successfully. After a lot of soul searching, conversations and research, I landed in management.

A lot of that first year was figuring out the foundation of how I wanted to handle my clients, introducing myself to people in the industry who didn’t know me yet, taking in content so I knew what the market looked like, reading the trades to get to know the players through a new lense and developing relationships with people I could access on a level that allowed me to. I would sit down for coffee with anyone who would talk to me about their perspective, their approach - casting directors, agents, other managers, creatives. I read every indie script I could get my hands on and saw every play I could because those were the parts of the market I could get to at that first stage. It was basically about hitting the books, hitting the pavement and knocking on doors - all things I still do today. Everyone in our business has to go through their paces and train up, it just takes different forms as your career evolves. Everyone is constantly developing and engaging new skills, absorbing new content - that’s part of what makes this all so interesting to be part of.

Was there ever a moment where you questioned this career path? If so, how did you get through that time?

The beginning was certainly hard for me - people usually assume it had something to do with struggling with my transition out of performance or something, but no. I actually find my 20+ years experience and training in that arena to be a major asset because it helps me understand the drive and artistic sentiments of my clients and informs my ability to have meaningful conversations with creatives about their projects - but mostly because it took quite some time for me to be taken seriously by my peers. There are a lot of interesting opinions out there about managers, and everyone loves to share them with you when they find out you are one (hahaha), which I didn’t really expect at the beginning. I understand where a lot of it comes from, but it was pretty wild at first because I had no idea there was so much negativity thrown at this profession I chose - I would read about the Bernie Brillsteins and the Shep Gordons and be enamored by the multi-faceted nature of the role and how it evolves over time, so I guess I was a little naive to that outside perspective of managers until I was in the middle of it. To this day I still run into those opinions pretty regularly in one shade or another (especially being a boutique manager), but I’ve developed some really great relationships over the past few years who are incredibly supportive of me and what I’m trying to build, and that’s worth its weight in gold. 

You do a lot of producing as well. Can you talk us through getting started with that realm of the business?

Yeah! It’s a bit of a new frontier for me in a way, though I had a decent amount of hands on experience in my previous life but didn’t really realize that’s what I was doing - at that time we were just having fun making theater or building events or shows or what have you, so we figured it out as we went. Now I’ve started slowly working in film, which is a horse of a different color. I’m still learning the ropes of where I’m most useful on that side of things, but my current projects usually have me either finding and developing material that I think is interesting or has something to say and connecting those ideas with great people who can help shape it or by being boots on the ground dealing with the day-to-day needs of and admin affecting the talent directly (because those are the roles that closely match my existing skill set). The more I’m on set, the more I’m in a position to learn new things - and that challenge is a big part of why I love it. It’s also a pretty incredible thing to help support creatives you respect in realizing a story they want to tell while also creating opportunities for your clients. There’s a lot of reasons why producing is a real good time and I’m very lucky I get to do it on occasion. 

At the onset of your career, what was the definition of success you were aspiring to achieve? Now, where you are at, how do you describe your success?

It’s weird - I feel like the only time I defined success for myself as a performer was when I told my high school yearbook that my goal was to make a living as a performer. And then I did. Hahaha. I’ve really just focused on whatever was directly in front of me when it came to my own career, and that has suited me well because I’m good at adapting. Now that I’m in management, I do tend to set more strategic goals or contemplate bigger picture concepts for myself because that’s the nature of what I do - I spend much of my time switching back and forth between checking on the forest and focusing on the trees when it comes to my clients, so I try to use a similar approach with my own career.

In terms of saying my new personal career goals in print for a bunch of people to read kinda scares the crap out of me because I’m afraid I’ll jinx it - haha - but I do tend to set annual goals for myself and for my company. “This year I want to accomplish this...check, check, check.” That way you’re building things slowly instead of getting ahead of yourself and you’ll hopefully have the opportunity to enjoy some of your successes as they come. A couple of the current goals I will generalize out loud is that I would love to find more opportunities to give back to the community in a meaningful way and I would love to develop more opportunities to teach. I can usually only do it a few times a year because of the demands on my schedule, but I really enjoy talking to college performance departments about the business of “The Business” - I feel like it’s incredibly beneficial for graduates to leave their programs with at least a general sense of how to navigate the professional world after they graduate and I love being part of that process.

What’s something you wish you had done or wish you had known earlier?

I don’t know that I have anything I wish I’d done. There’s probably something but I try not to dwell on that stuff too often - it doesn’t help me. I do wish I had been better about trusting my instincts and welcoming the word “No” into my vocabulary at an earlier stage of my career. Not everyone is going to like you all the time, so go ahead and stand up for yourself - that’s another one. Yes, of course it’s smart to pick your battles, and there’s a way to do it respectfully, but if you decide something is genuinely worth fighting for or about, there’s most likely a damn good reason. Trust yourself - instincts and passion are what tend to make people great at what they do.

Where are you on your mountain?

Always climbing. Mountains are big and that’s kinda the point - if you’ve reached the top too quickly, you probably picked a hill and should take some time to re-evaluate before you get bored. Pivot. Expand your horizons.

RAPID FIRE!

Favorite Broadway show of all time: Tie - Assassins (Revival), Hedwig and the Angry Inch, Hamilton, Next to Normal.

TV show that you love: You’re killing me, I watch way too much TV because I love it. Seriously - cable, steaming, network - so much TV. Here are just a few I've watched most recently and love..."The Morning Show," "Succession," "The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel," "You," "The Righteous Gemstones," "Shameless," Letterkenny," "Fleabag," "Schitt's Creek," "Veep," "Black/Grown/Mixed-ish"...I could literally do this all day. I also love basically all things Ryan Murphy and all things Aaron Sorkin - I just barreled through "The West Wing" and I'll probably do it again in a year because it's just so damn good.

Favorite music on your commute: I’m still a musician at heart so I rotate through a LOT of music. Currently I’m listening to The Raconteurs, Flogging Molly, Gin Wigmore, Kings of Leon and Mickey Avalon. LOL. I also love Cardi B and Lizzo but I don’t have any of their stuff on my phone yet. Sad face.

Any other obsessions?: In no particular order - Movies/documentaries; Andy Warhol; my cats; good food (who doesn’t?); traveling (though I don’t get to do nearly as much as I’d like); and reading autobiographies/biographies about actors, especially silver screen starlets, and the business - I’m currently reading  Joan Crawford’s My Way of Life and it’s a HOOT.

Social media is ________: Not going anywhere. Also, perception is reality.

Religious, Spiritual, or nah?: Spiritual? Though when I say it like that I feel like I should be drinking kombucha in a sun ray while wearing ironic glasses and looking thoughtful. (I’m not.)

Actor-ism that frustrates you: Lack of commitment and lack of drive - invest in yourself because if you don’t you can’t expect other people to. Also, shadiness or rudeness. I can’t want it more than you, and if I’m going to work as hard for you as I do, treat me with respect.

Call or Email?: Email, mostly because it’s easier to pull up details later when I need to backtrack and also because my days are super full so an unexpected long phone call can throw my schedule off hard. If you need to discuss something deep, email to set a call and we’ll set it (unless it’s an emergency, of course). Good news is also obviously fine...call away with that! :-)

Biggest beef with the business: I know we’re in a competitive business, but we’re also in a small business...so when people are rude or short right off the bat it friggin’ kills me. It doesn’t impress me, and it doesn’t make me respect you more. I don’t care who you are - every day kindness is important and applies to everyone. That also includes if I see anyone being snotty to an assistant or intern or PA or monitor. That’s a big nope in my book, and I will remember it - it says a lot more about you than it does about them, trust.

Favorite part about being a Manager? Sharing in my client’s successes and watching their careers develop - it’s incredibly rewarding to watch someone grow into their potential.

Hardest part of being a Manager?: When you know what someone’s capable of but they fight it or give up - I think that’s worse than when you help clear the path and they burn you. And when I say give up, I don’t mean they leave the business - making the decision to follow a different path is completely respectable and can be incredibly rewarding and fulfilling for that person. Do you. By giving up, I mean those who won’t let go but also won’t put the work in. That’s what giving up looks like to me - it’s like putting yourself in purgatory. 

I get inspired when _______: When the team is on the same page and everyone is working hard and things are moving forward - that day-to-day cohesiveness, that synergy, is incredibly inspiring. Luckily for me the agents and clients I work with bring a lot to the table so they keep me pretty inspired. Otherwise, why do this? 

Photos:

Heller Awards, 2019

TMANY Holiday Party 2019 Ben Jordan/Michael Bloom

TMANY Holiday Party 2017, with Marc Shaer